Do we know how Yeshua lived his life?

[Rainrider]

Hello, new here... learing is a process, such is HIS life and example to. I appreciate a comment I saw earlier, to the one who started the post, could you kindly say what it is you think people are missing? That's a great question; Also, to the comment that all we know about HIM is written in scripture, is it not? Consider then John 21:25 Now there are also many other things that Jesus did. Were every one of them to be written, I suppose that the world itself could not contain the books that would be written.

I appreciate the challenge with this thought and notion, although I don't believe God shorted us or gave us a disadvantage by not giving us enough material in the Bible to read upon. Also consider the passage in Luke 24:25-27 25 And he said to them, “O foolish ones, and slow of heart to believe all that the prophets have spoken! 26 Was it not necessary that the Christ should suffer these things and enter into his glory?” 27 And beginning with Moses and all the Prophets, he interpreted to them in all the Scriptures the things concerning himself.

And lets not forget the notion of the other writings in John whereby the Holy Spirit would come and remind us of all Jesus already taught; And contrast that with the fact Paul wrote that people without the knowledge of scripture (or in Paul's day anything related to what we refer to as Old Testament writings) somehow were doing the right thing where those with the scripture weren't.

There's a fascinating way about HIM, HE isn't limited in how HE can reach and teach. People learn to do right by coming into right relationship with HIM in many wonderous ways.

But for now, I agree with the above noted question, what do you think is missing from Jesus' life and example that needs to be sought out and stated? Thanks for thought provoking question!

What is missing isn't what you may think. You see when one STUDIES the whole of the Word, they begin to see how it all fits together. Sadly, over time what we find in Torah has been left behind. As my last post makes clear, we should try to understand not just the words of Yeshua, the setting, and His actions, all come together to show us more than just words. The adversity, and misunderstanding of the leaders that wish to kill Him, also show us a part of our own leaders. So it isn't so much that something is missing, so much as it is what we miss by not taking time to study every aspect of the Word.

As I have said this thread is about Yeshua and not Paul. Our reason for leaving Paul out of this conversation is simple. In EVERY thread I have ever opened, Paul is used to muddy the water so to speak. Some wish to give Paul more authority that Yeshua. To give an example that is not from the Word directly. If you are working for someone, they hold the finale say in all matters. No one working for said person holds more authority than their boss. Just as a follower of Yeshua, such as Paul, doesn't hold more authority than Yeshua. As you may have seen in this thread, some have tried to use Paul to remove the teachings of Yeshua. So I am trying to keep Paul out of this, so that anyone reading can see the teachings of Yeshua, without having to wade through the mud to find it.
Before you make a claim that isn't true, keep in mind we are only in the 8th chapter of John. When we get to the passages you noted, they will be covered. I know that some will try and say I am doing nothing more than forcing a conversation into my own understanding. However that isn't true at all. Those same people are the ones that if I would give them free rain here, would turn this into a, BUT PAUL SAID debate. In which the teachings of Yeshua would be lost to Paul said. Take the idea that they will try to use Paul to remove the Tanakh. They hold almost no understanding of the Tanakh, and it seems as though the use of this is sinful in their minds.
You are 100% right Yeshua does show us His truth when we are open to it. However, we must keep in mind that He will not force us to follow His truth.
last thing on this, then I will give you time to reply.
If we don't know how the feast work, what they are, and why they are there for us to study and live out in our lives, how will we even have a full understanding of Yeshua's life, teachings, and faith? If we are to walk after His example, should we not understand what it is we are to do?

 

[Jeraboo]

What is missing isn't what you may think. You see when one STUDIES the whole of the Word, they begin to see how it all fits together. Sadly, over time what we find in Torah has been left behind. As my last post makes clear, we should try to understand not just the words of Yeshua, the setting, and His actions, all come together to show us more than just words. The adversity, and misunderstanding of the leaders that wish to kill Him, also show us a part of our own leaders. So it isn't so much that something is missing, so much as it is what we miss by not taking time to study every aspect of the Word.

As I have said this thread is about Yeshua and not Paul. Our reason for leaving Paul out of this conversation is simple. In EVERY thread I have ever opened, Paul is used to muddy the water so to speak. Some wish to give Paul more authority that Yeshua. To give an example that is not from the Word directly. If you are working for someone, they hold the finale say in all matters. No one working for said person holds more authority than their boss. Just as a follower of Yeshua, such as Paul, doesn't hold more authority than Yeshua. As you may have seen in this thread, some have tried to use Paul to remove the teachings of Yeshua. So I am trying to keep Paul out of this, so that anyone reading can see the teachings of Yeshua, without having to wade through the mud to find it.
Before you make a claim that isn't true, keep in mind we are only in the 8th chapter of John. When we get to the passages you noted, they will be covered. I know that some will try and say I am doing nothing more than forcing a conversation into my own understanding. However that isn't true at all. Those same people are the ones that if I would give them free rain here, would turn this into a, BUT PAUL SAID debate. In which the teachings of Yeshua would be lost to Paul said. Take the idea that they will try to use Paul to remove the Tanakh. They hold almost no understanding of the Tanakh, and it seems as though the use of this is sinful in their minds.
You are 100% right Yeshua does show us His truth when we are open to it. However, we must keep in mind that He will not force us to follow His truth.
last thing on this, then I will give you time to reply.
If we don't know how the feast work, what they are, and why they are there for us to study and live out in our lives, how will we even have a full understanding of Yeshua's life, teachings, and faith? If we are to walk after His example, should we not understand what it is we are to do?

Thank you for taking the time to respond. I see you are partly through John, yes. There's a lot more. I can appreciate the concern of how Yeshua, Jesus and Pauline teachings have (in english and taken out of context) seem to present a conflict, but in deeper study of context and written language of the time (which requires knowing a thing or two of old and new greek (septugiant impact), the aramaic topic and the hebrew) as well as interpretive issues, you will actually find that Paul never conflicts Yeshua, Jesus at all. Of course, why would he, he was called by HIM, and worked humbly for HIM. Not against HIM. That's all for now, but there's more to respond to and more to ponder here. Thank you again

 

[Burn1986]

I find it sad that I listed this 3 days ago and it has not been posted. Well things do get over looked, so let try once more.
In this study I do ask that we keep to the life of Yeshua, how He lived His life, what religion He followed, and what His study/teaching tools were. After all if we fail to understand this, how can we say follow His example?
The Word is clear on one thing,

Hos 4:6My people are destroyed for lack of knowledge: because thou hast rejected knowledge, I will also reject thee, that thou shalt be no priest to me: seeing thou hast forgotten the law of thy God, I will also forget thy children.

As I have seen in every post I opened, there are some that simply wish to make sure they are heard, and any one that stands in opposition of their thinking must be talked over, belittled, and or forced out. Anything to stop their understanding from getting out. However, they have little to say about how Yeshua lived His life, or what His guiding principles were.
If this thread is approved, we will examine the Life of Yeshua, and seek to find how He walked in His life. From His teachings, and His teaching alone we can learn more than one may think. I know that what I ask now will be over looked, ignored, or otherwise pushed aside. Still I must ask. If you wish to try and derail this study, please don't post. Keep in mind we are looking the life of Yeshua, NOT PAUL. Thank you for your understanding in this simple request.

We only know what’s in the Bible right? I know there were manuscripts and all that but that’s a lot of work. Jesus was obedient to his mom and dad, especially after they were stressed and couldn’t find Him that one day. The rest would only be assumptions right? Did He have thoughts of racing camels and seeing how far he could hit a rock with a stick? Who knows?

 

[Rainrider]

Thank you for taking the time to respond. I see you are partly through John, yes. There's a lot more. I can appreciate the concern of how Yeshua, Jesus and Pauline teachings have (in english and taken out of context) seem to present a conflict, but in deeper study of context and written language of the time (which requires knowing a thing or two of old and new greek (septugiant impact), the aramaic topic and the hebrew) as well as interpretive issues, you will actually find that Paul never conflicts Yeshua, Jesus at all. Of course, why would he, he was called by HIM, and worked humbly for HIM. Not against HIM. That's all for now, but there's more to respond to and more to ponder here. Thank you again

You are right in that Paul never contradicts Yeshua, how ever as you will find on here, some do try to use his writings in just that fashion. I look forward to seeing you again, enjoy your self and watch out there be wolves in the forest.
May HaShem guide your studies, as he has ours. Oh so you know, the we, that you will find me speaking of is a groop of theachers like myself, that work to restore the truth of the Word, we don't follow any western, or Jewish theology. It has taken us some years to get where we are, and there has been some rather heated debate to get here.

 

[Rainrider]

We only know what’s in the Bible right? I know there were manuscripts and all that but that’s a lot of work. Jesus was obedient to his mom and dad, especially after they were stressed and couldn’t find Him that one day. The rest would only be assumptions right? Did He have thoughts of racing camels and seeing how far he could hit a rock with a stick? Who knows?

We have no reason to assume anything. We are not here to look at if Yeshua played baseball or not. His life as we should know was His faith. His teachings were a big part of that, He opened doors of understanding not found anywhere else in the Word. It when one starts to assume that they get lost, so lets stay with facts, and see where that leads us.
As for the work, well one only gets out of any thing what they are willing to put into it. Yeshua never said,, don't worry about what the Word teaches, you don't need it. So please put in the work, and show yourself approved.

 

[SomeDisciple]

During the days of Jesus’ earthly life, He offered up prayers and petitions with loud cries and tears to the One who could save Him from death, and He was heard because of His reverence. Although He was a Son, He learned obedience from what He suffered. And having been made perfect, He became the source of eternal salvation to all who obey Him and was designated by God as high priest in the order of Melchizedek.

By this we can be sure that we have come to know Him: if we keep His commandments. If anyone says, “I know Him,” but does not keep His commandments, he is a liar, and the truth is not in him. But if anyone keeps His word, the love of God has been truly perfected in him. By this we know that we are in Him: Whoever claims to abide in Him must walk as Jesus walked.

 

[Rainrider]

Some may think I stopped when , and where in order to change context unnoticed. However that is rather hard to do when your words are placed for the world to see. Oddly yes, I did stop before I should have, sorry. After all the next passage should be placed in context with the verse that proceeded it.

Jhn 8:16And if I did, my judgment would be correct in every respect because I am not alone. The Father [fn] who sent me is with me.
Jhn 8:17Your own law says that if two people agree about something, their witness is accepted as fact

Now we think it best to make 2 teachings on this clear.
1 Some say that with the words YOUR LAW, Yeshua was trying to separate Himself from Torah.
2 Some say that the use of YOUR LAW was making it clear that Yeshua didn't up hold Rabbinic Law. We will not voice to one over the other here, so please don't think that the placement of them holds any kind of hidden meaning or agenda. After all was it not the same law that both followed? On the surface maybe. So we will let Yeshua show us His stand on things as we move on. It would be a bit deceitful. At lest to some anyway.

Jhn 8:18I am one witness, and my Father who sent me is the other."
Jhn 8:19"Where is your father?" they asked.
Jesus answered, "Since you don't know who I am, you don't know who my Father is. If you knew me, you would also know my Father."
Here we find that Yeshua is making it clear who He is. Now I had a real hard time with this many years back. Then one of the others challanged me try something. I place that challange to all of you know. When you read the name Yeshua, (Jesus) try useing HaShem in the same passage. If it doesn't change the intent or meaning, then what you are looking at is HaShem, if not then you are looking at the man not the spirit that fills the man. I know it sounds odd, yet it works.

Jhn 8:20Jesus made these statements while he was teaching in the section of the Temple known as the Treasury. But he was not arrested, because his time had not yet come.
More than once we have seen that it was not His time. So what is meant by this? Some will say He had not started his ministry. Others say it has to do with the timing for His sacrifice. No matter what we may think, it holds little if any meaning in the minds of some, so we will let this answer it's self as we move on.

Jhn 8:21Later Jesus said to them again, "I am going away. You will search for me but will die in your sin. You cannot come where I am going."
Jhn 8:22The people asked, "Is he planning to commit suicide? What does he mean, 'You cannot come where I am going'?"
Jhn 8:23Jesus continued, "You are from below; I am from above. You belong to this world; I do not.

Hoe many times in your life have you said, You are not at home in this world? Oddly we understand that we are nothing than sojourners in this world. You see once we truly give our lives to HaShem, this world losses it's grip on us. We no long strive for riches in this life, rather we store up riches in Heaven. Mat. 6: 19-20.

Jhn 8:24That is why I said that you will die in your sins; for unless you believe that I AM who I claim to be, you will die in your sins."

Jhn 8:25"Who are you?" they demanded.
Jesus replied, "The one I have always claimed to be.


There is some debate over this passage. Some will say that Yeshua never made the claim that He was haShem, others say He had. What must be noted here is that I AM is the one name in all of scripture given as HaShems name. Oh sure we see othe names placed in scripture as being His. However only once does he give the name Yahovah, I AM) as his name. I would be happy to bring that up and make it clear, however as stated the same limits I place on others must also be imposed on us. So no matter how much we wish to post that passage, we will uphold those limits. Besides, We are sure you all know it, if you know anything about the stories found in the Torah.

 

[Rainrider]

It was pointed out that I made statement and didn't follow through with the thought. If so, you have my apology. However when looking back I didn't find this to be the case. You see when I said Yeshua must fulfill all 7 feast, (or however I worded it), I didn't go into details on every feast. As we know the fulfillment of a feast is only accomplished when Yeshua fulfills the intent of the feast. When we stand in judgement, Yeshua will fulfill Yom Kipper, when he passes said judgement.
As I said when this was pointed out, I am more than happy to do another thread on the feast, there meaning, what they show us about Yeshua, and so on. Even though it has been clear by many people, they have no desire to lean anything that is not 100% in line with their ideology.
So if anyone wishes a study on the feast, let it be known, and I am more than willing to open a thread for that.

 

[Rainrider]

Jhn 8:26I have much to say about you and much to condemn, but I won't. For I say only what I have heard from the one who sent me, and he is completely truthful."
Jhn 8:27But they still didn't understand that he was talking about his Father.

I always love this passage, as it brings to mind something that happens a lot in my life. You see much like the people Yeshua was speaking with, not many understand what I mean when I say I am ready to go home. They think I am going to my house. However that isn't home, it is just a place to rest my head as I sojourn in this world that isn't mine. Home is where my Father is, where my rewords, where no crime takes place ever, and joy is the order of the day, every day.

Jhn 8:28So Jesus said, "When you have lifted up the Son of Man on the cross, then you will understand that I AM he. I do nothing on my own but say only what the Father taught me.
Jhn 8:29And the one who sent me is with me—he has not deserted me. For I always do what pleases him."
Jhn 8:30Then many who heard him say these things believed in him.

Can it be that a simple statement like this changed the hearts and minds of people, that just seconds ago were against Yeshua? I would think not. Although if we look a little deeper what do we find? The ones that believe Him, seen paast the words, and found truth. You see much like today, many of Yeshua's teachings were misunderstood. So it is our thinking that when Yeshua said ,"You will understand that I AM He." they seen past the words and understood that Yeshua was indeed Who He said He was. HaShem in human form. Every thing He did, gave witness to Him, and Who He is. More on this will be seen as time goes on.
Jhn 8:31Jesus said to the people who believed in him, "You are truly my disciples if you remain faithful to my teachings.
I know that some will think I am beating a dead horse here, however, as is made clear here, if Paul, John, Peter, or any of His followers turned away from the Teachings of Yeshua, then they were not His followers. Logical thinking mandates that any thought, teaching, or study must be in harmony with the whole of said topic. So when a person makes the attempt to use scripture to nullify scripture, they are not following logic at all.
Jhn 8:32And you will know the truth, and the truth will set you free."
Jhn 8:33"But we are descendants of Abraham," they said. "We have never been slaves to anyone. What do you mean, 'You will be set free'?"
Jhn 8:34Jesus replied, "I tell you the truth, everyone who sins is a slave of sin.
Although it is true that Israel was enslaved by more than one nation, and at this time were under servitude to Rome, they didn't understand that they were in fact slaves. Not just to Rome, rather also to their own fleshly desire. Something that everyone struggles with, even today. I know there some that don't wish to see them selves as sinners, yet it is true. Not one person on this earth can say they don't, haven't or ever will sin. Sorry if that hits home in a way that makes you uncomfortable, yet the truth has a way of doing that. Yes it does say we will be set free from that, however if we don't wake up and seek the truth, we are still in our sin.
Jhn 8:35A slave is not a permanent member of the family, but a son is part of the family forever.
Jhn 8:36So if the Son sets you free, you are truly free.
Though many will think this is saying they are free, they might be right. If they walk a sin free life.
Jhn 8:37Yes, I realize that you are descendants of Abraham. And yet some of you are trying to kill me because there's no room in your hearts for my message.
Jhn 8:38I am telling you what I saw when I was with my Father. But you are following the advice of your father."
Jhn 8:39"Our father is Abraham!" they declared. "No," Jesus replied, "for if you were really the children of Abraham, you would follow his example.
Some may wish to say this is for the Jews, and that as a gentile we don't need the Laws, much less an understanding of Abraham, and how he lived his life. If that is your understanding, I pray you seek a fuller understanding. After all, is it not true that once we give our lives over to HaShem, we become grafted into the family of Abraham? As we will see Yeshua does teach this, as we will see once we get there.
Jhn 8:40Instead, you are trying to kill me because I told you the truth, which I heard from God. Abraham never did such a thing.
So what is it that shows they are not following the example of Abraham? The idea that they wish to kill Yeshua? The fact that their pride gets the better of them? Or it might be that they have rejected truth, in order to stay with their own ideas of faith? We would love to see what you think on this.
Jhn 8:41No, you are imitating your real father."
They replied, "We aren't illegitimate children! God himself is our true Father."
So much for believeing in Yeshua. Yes it has been said that here is a contradiction. They believe, then they make it clear they don't. However for any thinking this, keep in mind there were more than just believers in this setting. Though we are not told who is saying this, it is clear they didn't understand what was being said.
More when we return.